„Czasami musimy pociągnąć za spust” | Ian Collins GRILLS Przewodniczący Federacji Policyjnej



A man in his 30s who was reportedly armed with a crossbow has been shot dead by armed police in south-east London.

The Metropolitan Police said the man was trying to force his way into a building in Bywater Place, Surrey Quays, just before 5am on Tuesday and was threatening to hurt the people inside.

Unarmed officers tried to speak to him but were threatened, and when police marksmen arrived he had got into the building and was shot.

He was given first aid but died at the scene, and police are trying to contact his family.

Neighbours said they were woken up by a burst of screaming and shouting.

Chair of Police Federation of England and Wales, Steve Hartshorn joins TalkTV to analyse the situation.

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Look we will await more detail of course from what we know and what we heard nick uh point to there um based on that this seems like almost a textbook example of the police responding in the absolute correct way establishing the facts surveying the scene realizing where the threat was and acting on

It it does and it seems like it shows an escalation of of use of force by unarmed colleagues turning up first to do with what was probably a 999 call a disturbance may be in the street or in the house then they it appears that they’ve been threatened um by an

Individual they then call for armed response support to support them in their needs and then obviously things have escalated where my former colleagues have had to effective enter a building and have taken what’s called decisive action they’ve obviously felt that immediate threat to life was so

Imminent they had no option but to use um a firearm to deal with that threat to neutralize any ongoing threat either to the occupants inside the house themselves on on colleagues so um yeah it’s um it sounds like it’s a an effective operation to do with it but

Obviously nobody wants anybody to die of course and which brings me to the next point I mean there is I mean there are agitators out there police people who aren’t fans of the police I should say you’re a trained Firearms officer so you know what it’s like to hold a gun and

Have to um attend scenes and situations where you may be required to use it no officer with your level of training wakes up in the morning and says what a great day to go and shoot some this is done really as a last result it’s done in response emergency response to

Something it doesn’t just happen no it’s generally always reactive unless you happen to be driving around the Streets of London or indeed any farms office in the country if you see something happening you have to deal with it you have a fraction of amount of time to

Decide in your powers your policy your use of force your backdrop your foreground is it the right weapon you’re using are there any members of the public nearby the collateral intrusion that could happen if you don’t do something there and then if you delay that might be just as as bad as not

Doing anything or as taking action so it’s a very complex um set of thoughts that go through an individual’s mind when they’re about to deploy when they deploy but of course they’ll now be thinking they’ll actually be still going through What’s called the post instant process right now yeah um I gather it

Happened at 5:00 this morning that would have been a night Duty team they’ll probably still be on duty going through those initial accounts to make sure that this independent investigation gets some very very good timely evidence from to start with and that will be followed up

Yeah indeed and when the incident It’s s incidents themselves when when these happen and you attend a scene such as this someone’s got a firearm a knife whatever it happens to be and it looks and there is clear and obvious danger to others whether it’s the officers members

Of the public a family member what whatever it happens to be um what what’s the procedure then does an individual officer there might be half a dozen officers pointing guns towards a house is there a discussion in the ear that says right one of you has got to dispatch your firearm here or

Does an individual simply take that decision in that moment no it’s every time a use of force by a farmers officer it’s an individual decision you might have specific orders about where you are placed on that team whether you go to the front of the premises the rear the

Side you might be deployed as a as a long eye to maybe with a different rifle to get a Long Long View into the building there’s officer approaching but every single use of force is down that individual person to decide in those particular circumstan and they will of

Course have to justify that to any independent investigation which is now taking place yeah um this won’t come as a shock to you Steve there are some people out there who don’t like the police uh there are one or two pressure groups or interested parties that think

That you guys are you know a bunch of trigger happy characters that go around almost like gangs you know doing whatever you like it’s a complete Urban myth there’s nothing de there’s no demonstrable evidence for any of that and in fact the idea that we have a

Trigger happy police force is just not born out in any of the figures I think there were 26,000 uh incidents last year or times when officers had to attend armed I think that could be taser as well as uh conventional Firearms um last year in London one person was shot dead

That was a white person I mentioned that only because race often does get loaded into this debate I I sense that as a bit of a distraction but there are groups that do introduce that um police fire guns reluctantly they don’t do it because they want to it is not a trigger

Happy police force is it I mean the numbers compared you go to other forget America and places like that even other similar countries I know we’re not routinely armed uh in the UK but even allowing for that it’s very rare for an officer to fire a gun yeah if you look

At some of the home office owned figures in the year it published November last year I think it’s 369,000 two were actually Farmers is charges that the chances of farm ring are so small it’s very rare that’s why it makes big headlines however there’s a job to be done and

When that immediate threat is there our very brave courageous police officers and our Farms officers are prepared to step forward into danger they don’t know what’s going to happen they don’t know what else these individuals have they do the job of protecting the public and they do it very very well so I

Understand people’s concerns but look at the evidence look at the job they do the training they get and again this is an independent investigation by the iopc it’s not run internally all the evidence will be given to them they will run it they will make their decisions and then

We’ll go from there uh it’s interesting is that in a case such as this officers are out there there’s a guy with a crossbow that much we know uh he’s clearly posing some sort of threat he’s broken into a house there’s a distressed call to 999 I mean those officers uh are

Facing a man with a crossbow for goodness sake you know a crossbow is not a little it’s not a peashooter a crossbow will kill you it’s a very dangerous weapon and it would if it didn’t kill it would cause horrendous damage um it what is an officer supposed

To to do in that sit they me to go look I’m not going to carry a gun I’m not going to do anything about this I’ll just I’ll take the bullet I’ll take one for the team I don’t think so no and it’s interesting because every set of circumstan is different the training

They get is first right I’d say our Farmers officers get the best training in the world I’m naturally biased but they do a really good job and the main premise is to identify locate container premises or the person and neutralize the threat and by the safest means possible but sometimes the public don’t

Get that briefing they don’t understand that they’re supposed to stand still when we tell them to stand still through why a concoction of drink drugs mental ill health physical impairment they’re just not able to comply with some what we would say very basic instructions that’s no fault theirs yeah but we have

To act to protect everybody my colleagues the public uh anybody that comes into contact we have to deal with that threat appropriately and sometimes we have to pull the trigger it has to be done it’s to stop an ongoing harm to somebody else otherwise this could have

Been a different process where we have other members of the public who’ve sadly been killed yeah and then people would be criticizing the police for not for not acting you know there were firearms officers there you didn’t do anything about it for goodness sake there’ll be that




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